Comments on: Where Are The CPMs? http://missionsmisunderstood.com/2007/01/25/where-are-the-cpms/ Let's give the Commission back to the church. Fri, 17 Feb 2012 18:47:57 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Anonymous http://missionsmisunderstood.com/2007/01/25/where-are-the-cpms/comment-page-1/#comment-1001 Anonymous Sun, 14 Oct 2007 21:50:00 +0000 http://missionsmisunderstood.com/2007/01/25/where-are-the-cpms/#comment-1001 Gosh, I think it is great to have a focus on building churches, but as a short-termer in WE I feel like all we talk about is strategy and ways to start churches when most of the missionaries here don't have any REAL relationships to speak of with the people group to even start a core group. It's like the first step never gets talked about. <br/>Its really frustrating that so much time gets taken up with things (like events, conferences, big wigs, meetings, volunteers, ect.) that we can't consistently see people to build relationships. Sure those things that take up our time are good sometimes, but it just makes it that much harder to see much happen, especially when you are here for 2 years. <br/>Oh, and short-termers shouldn't have the job title of "church planter". Gosh, I think it is great to have a focus on building churches, but as a short-termer in WE I feel like all we talk about is strategy and ways to start churches when most of the missionaries here don’t have any REAL relationships to speak of with the people group to even start a core group. It’s like the first step never gets talked about.
Its really frustrating that so much time gets taken up with things (like events, conferences, big wigs, meetings, volunteers, ect.) that we can’t consistently see people to build relationships. Sure those things that take up our time are good sometimes, but it just makes it that much harder to see much happen, especially when you are here for 2 years.
Oh, and short-termers shouldn’t have the job title of “church planter”.

]]> By: Uncle http://missionsmisunderstood.com/2007/01/25/where-are-the-cpms/comment-page-1/#comment-835 Uncle Thu, 05 Apr 2007 13:02:00 +0000 http://missionsmisunderstood.com/2007/01/25/where-are-the-cpms/#comment-835 I feel a need to comment here on where cpm comes from ...I am with you when you say that it is God who makes it happen, yet I feel compelled to say this. It appears that much of the work that is going on in your countries is being done by the M. I am in EAsia and we are currently in CPM out to the 5th level and if I had to put my finger on a few things that are practicle I would point out the following. Our guys demonstrait an extreem obedience and in that they share their faith (I have one guy who lead 200 people to faith last year), and they have a system and a vision that they believe is obtainable. They believe that God has given and will continue to give their city to them. It is not M driven, I help them solve problems, give them vision and help them think ourside of their box...but I never pickup the baton, I never do for them what they can do for themselves.<br/>Uncle I feel a need to comment here on where cpm comes from …I am with you when you say that it is God who makes it happen, yet I feel compelled to say this. It appears that much of the work that is going on in your countries is being done by the M. I am in EAsia and we are currently in CPM out to the 5th level and if I had to put my finger on a few things that are practicle I would point out the following. Our guys demonstrait an extreem obedience and in that they share their faith (I have one guy who lead 200 people to faith last year), and they have a system and a vision that they believe is obtainable. They believe that God has given and will continue to give their city to them. It is not M driven, I help them solve problems, give them vision and help them think ourside of their box…but I never pickup the baton, I never do for them what they can do for themselves.
Uncle

]]> By: Justin Long http://missionsmisunderstood.com/2007/01/25/where-are-the-cpms/comment-page-1/#comment-810 Justin Long Fri, 23 Feb 2007 06:38:00 +0000 http://missionsmisunderstood.com/2007/01/25/where-are-the-cpms/#comment-810 10/40: Yes, there are. I know of more than a few but they are in very sensitive places. One word of encouragement (I think): if you go back and read everything written about a CPM, one thing is clear. MAN CANNOT MAKE A CPM HAPPEN. Only God does that. The main thing that man does in a CPM is pray, give, go, tell, and stay out of God's way so that when it does start happening, we don't do anything to dampen it. 10/40: Yes, there are. I know of more than a few but they are in very sensitive places. One word of encouragement (I think): if you go back and read everything written about a CPM, one thing is clear. MAN CANNOT MAKE A CPM HAPPEN. Only God does that. The main thing that man does in a CPM is pray, give, go, tell, and stay out of God’s way so that when it does start happening, we don’t do anything to dampen it.

]]> By: bryan riley http://missionsmisunderstood.com/2007/01/25/where-are-the-cpms/comment-page-1/#comment-788 bryan riley Mon, 05 Feb 2007 03:45:00 +0000 http://missionsmisunderstood.com/2007/01/25/where-are-the-cpms/#comment-788 Strider, you are hitting much with talking about gifts and faith. We have anesthetized (quenched) the Spirit with our lack of faith, and it is clear that such doubt prevents His people from entering the land. Strider, you are hitting much with talking about gifts and faith. We have anesthetized (quenched) the Spirit with our lack of faith, and it is clear that such doubt prevents His people from entering the land.

]]> By: A 10-40 Window Missionary http://missionsmisunderstood.com/2007/01/25/where-are-the-cpms/comment-page-1/#comment-782 A 10-40 Window Missionary Fri, 02 Feb 2007 08:50:00 +0000 http://missionsmisunderstood.com/2007/01/25/where-are-the-cpms/#comment-782 Stepchild,<br /><br />Your question, "Where are the CPM's?" has elicited some great responses, but none have answered that question, "Where are the CPM's?" Aside from China, are there any fast moving, self-replicating exponential growth of Churches? Stepchild,

Your question, “Where are the CPM’s?” has elicited some great responses, but none have answered that question, “Where are the CPM’s?” Aside from China, are there any fast moving, self-replicating exponential growth of Churches?

]]> By: Strider http://missionsmisunderstood.com/2007/01/25/where-are-the-cpms/comment-page-1/#comment-762 Strider Sun, 28 Jan 2007 18:31:00 +0000 http://missionsmisunderstood.com/2007/01/25/where-are-the-cpms/#comment-762 I know the discussion has moved on but I couldn't let the persecution thing slide. Persecution is very valuable for the church as it purifies it. Committed believers are left to love and care for each other in a community that looks out for itself or dies. This then is a powerful witness to the power of God and it shows the Church as the light that it is. <br />However, you can hardly find a more hostile environment to the Church than Western Europe. True evangelical churches can be spotted miles away and draw negative attention in any community they are in. In most European cities you would get more acceptance telling your family you were gay than telling them you were now a firm follower of Jesus. Yet, no cpm. <br />You might tell me that well, in some places people are being beaten a killed for Christ- well, yeah- they are in my own country. But there are lots of different kinds of persecution that reveals the true character of the church. No friends, you touch on one small aspect but there is much more going on. I know the discussion has moved on but I couldn’t let the persecution thing slide. Persecution is very valuable for the church as it purifies it. Committed believers are left to love and care for each other in a community that looks out for itself or dies. This then is a powerful witness to the power of God and it shows the Church as the light that it is.
However, you can hardly find a more hostile environment to the Church than Western Europe. True evangelical churches can be spotted miles away and draw negative attention in any community they are in. In most European cities you would get more acceptance telling your family you were gay than telling them you were now a firm follower of Jesus. Yet, no cpm.
You might tell me that well, in some places people are being beaten a killed for Christ- well, yeah- they are in my own country. But there are lots of different kinds of persecution that reveals the true character of the church. No friends, you touch on one small aspect but there is much more going on.

]]> By: Nomad http://missionsmisunderstood.com/2007/01/25/where-are-the-cpms/comment-page-1/#comment-760 Nomad Sun, 28 Jan 2007 00:38:00 +0000 http://missionsmisunderstood.com/2007/01/25/where-are-the-cpms/#comment-760 I have to agree with Publius. Of the several CPM's ongoing in Asia, they are in countries where it is illegal to be a Christian or where Christians are severely persecuted/penalized.<br /><br />I don't think you guys in Western Europe are "doing" anything wrong. I just don't think the "cookie cutter" approach works everywhere. That is why ALL OF ASIA is not experiencing CPM's. <br /><br />My RL gets bent out of shape because there are only a few going on in my region. Don't get me wrong; he praises God for that, but wants more.<br /><br />However, Stepchild, I do agree with you that it's time to take another look at your stategies and see what needs to be changed instead of just banging on the same ole nail, if it is caught in a knot. I have to agree with Publius. Of the several CPM’s ongoing in Asia, they are in countries where it is illegal to be a Christian or where Christians are severely persecuted/penalized.

I don’t think you guys in Western Europe are “doing” anything wrong. I just don’t think the “cookie cutter” approach works everywhere. That is why ALL OF ASIA is not experiencing CPM’s.

My RL gets bent out of shape because there are only a few going on in my region. Don’t get me wrong; he praises God for that, but wants more.

However, Stepchild, I do agree with you that it’s time to take another look at your stategies and see what needs to be changed instead of just banging on the same ole nail, if it is caught in a knot.

]]> By: Publius http://missionsmisunderstood.com/2007/01/25/where-are-the-cpms/comment-page-1/#comment-759 Publius Sat, 27 Jan 2007 04:58:00 +0000 http://missionsmisunderstood.com/2007/01/25/where-are-the-cpms/#comment-759 I'll throw this in, in favor of CPMs.<br /><br />I think the idea of concentrating on building self-replicating indigenous churches is right on. It's Biblical, and in the end it's the only thing that can possibly work.<br /><br />For what little it's worth (not even two cents - maybe two lire), the reason I believe CPMs don't work in Europe like they did in Asia is simple:<br /><br />Not enough persecution.<br /><br />Nothing makes the church grow like the guvment trying to stamp it out. I’ll throw this in, in favor of CPMs.

I think the idea of concentrating on building self-replicating indigenous churches is right on. It’s Biblical, and in the end it’s the only thing that can possibly work.

For what little it’s worth (not even two cents – maybe two lire), the reason I believe CPMs don’t work in Europe like they did in Asia is simple:

Not enough persecution.

Nothing makes the church grow like the guvment trying to stamp it out.

]]> By: Matt http://missionsmisunderstood.com/2007/01/25/where-are-the-cpms/comment-page-1/#comment-757 Matt Fri, 26 Jan 2007 13:04:00 +0000 http://missionsmisunderstood.com/2007/01/25/where-are-the-cpms/#comment-757 I just read this quote. Seems relevant to this conversation.<br /><br />"If we claim to justify the actions we take by the effects they promise, we shall be led to pride in the abuse of power in those cases when it seems that we can reach our goals by the means of our own disposal. … We are drawn into the two fold pride of thinking that we, more than others, see things as they really are and of claiming the duty and the power to coerce others in order to move history aright. If our faithfulness is to be guided by the kind of man Jesus was it must cease to be guided by the quest to have dominion over the course of events. We cannot sight down the line of our obedience to the attainment of the ends we seek."(Royal Priesthood p.203). I just read this quote. Seems relevant to this conversation.

“If we claim to justify the actions we take by the effects they promise, we shall be led to pride in the abuse of power in those cases when it seems that we can reach our goals by the means of our own disposal. … We are drawn into the two fold pride of thinking that we, more than others, see things as they really are and of claiming the duty and the power to coerce others in order to move history aright. If our faithfulness is to be guided by the kind of man Jesus was it must cease to be guided by the quest to have dominion over the course of events. We cannot sight down the line of our obedience to the attainment of the ends we seek.”(Royal Priesthood p.203).

]]> By: Strider http://missionsmisunderstood.com/2007/01/25/where-are-the-cpms/comment-page-1/#comment-756 Strider Fri, 26 Jan 2007 11:40:00 +0000 http://missionsmisunderstood.com/2007/01/25/where-are-the-cpms/#comment-756 What? What did I say? What? What did I say?

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